Welcome to the Cake Decorators Q&amp;A

Hello

thanks

Just thought of another problem I need help with. If royal icing etc doesn’t adhere to the buttercream this is a 4 tier cake how will I ensure the casks are adhered to each other if you know what I mean

Hello ctennant

If the flowers are large and not wired it will be quite difficult to adhere them to the cake. Unfortunately gravity will win. One way would be to use a small circle of sugarpaste as base to stick the flower using candy melt as glue. . Sugarpaste icing will adhere to buttercream and if the flowers are still soft they could be further supported with either spaghetti or cocktail sticks.
You could also try using very strong ganache made 4 parts white chocolate and 1 part double cream. Freeze spray would help instantly stick the flowers onto the ganache. Here’s some information on the spray:
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=chocolate+freeze+spray+uk&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b&gfe_rd=cr&ei=zR11WcPhMI3W8Ael0oXwBA

I get mine from Sous Chef but there are other suppliers. It’s great stuff, however it really does depend on how big the flowers are. Is the second post referring to how the cakes will adhere to one another? If so, all you need do is use either ganache or candy melts as glue. Royal icing will not be safe as it breaks down when it comes into contact with fat from the butter. Try some of these suggestions out on a small trial cake if you have time.

9,925

Hello thanks for the speedy reply as always. Can I ask when you mentioned a small circle of sugar paste as base sorry to be a bit thick but do you mean put some sugar paste on the base of the flower than use candy melts as glue to then stick that to the buttercream?

I also have another question the cake is meant to be rustic so she wants a pattern like ribbons around it you now when you put buttercream on an then get a spatular and make an indent around it, well I was sap plying the buttercream and allowing the layer to harden up in the fridge and then put a layer over to do the indentation and it was sort of all moulding into one big mess and I was loosing the straight sides etc anyway an experienced cake maker told me I could actually cover the cake in the buttercream and I could freeze it then the day before the wedding I could apply another layer of buttercream when the cake had been taken straight out of the freezer and then make the indentations well I did that perfectly straight edged buttercream cake and then I put about 1/4″ layer of buttercream on it straight fro m the freezer and it worked the indentations looked lovely and smooth but then condensation started slightly on the cake and to be honest hours later it looked fine but the buttercream didn’t really crust back up.

Any advice please on what to do to get this pattern. I know this is meant to be an easy pattern but its driving me mad.

Thanks

Yes that’s correct. Trim the base of the flower flat or angled to how you want it to sit on the cake. Place the circle of sugarpaste on the cake, stick it down with candy melts and then stick on the flower. Buttercream will have more structure if you add some ganache or melted chocolate to it. Take a peek at the buttercream chart for Paul’s recipe which uses ganache. If you read the blog through it explains how much to add. Blog is here: https://www.cakeflix.com/buttercream-covering-and-filling-guide
Another way to stabilise buttercream is by adding meringue powder which helps buttercream to crust over. There are lots of tutorials online showing how much to add. Here is one: https://www.craftsy.com/blog/stabilizing-american-buttercream/

Search on youtube for techniques on how to perfect ridged buttercream pattern. I think its a case of practising it. I use a cake decorating combs with different patterned teeth on my ganached cakes.

9,925

Hello
Hello

I thought about using white chocolate ganache but the bride although she wants each tier in buttercream she also wants it flavoured and because she wants vanilla, blueberry and slated caramel to make life easier I’ve bought a boat load of the sugar and crumbs flavoured icing sugars so if I try and add the white chocolate ganache to them will it affect the taste too much do you think or do you think it will be ok?

I’v tried sticking the sugar paste to the buttercream with candy melts and it just won’t stick. I always thought the butter in the buttercream dissolved the sugar paste. Funny this should be quite an easy cake but its turning into a bit of a pain.

thanks

The amount of ganache which is used to stabilise the buttercream is very small and will not affect the tast of the buttercream. If you take a look at the buttercream chart blog, you’ll see the % of ganache to used
If the flowers are not sticking it is probably because they are too heavy and need further support as suggested in my answer above. Might be worth you trying the chocolate coolspray?? it works on buttercream too.
Unfortunately heavy flowers need wiring and supporting into cake in either posy picks or straws. Another suggestion might be to persuade the customer to have a design which doesn’t require flowers cascading down the sides of the cake. Instead have them sitting at the bottom edge of each tier.

Buttercream does not melt sugarpaste. A lot of decorators use it as crumbcoat under sugarpaste because not everyone like using ganache. The design itself is not too difficult, the problem is getting the flowers to stick.

9,925

Hello

I used the meringue powder in the buttercream and when I used the flavoured icing sugar it was so much better than if I used normal icing sugar and added my own flavours .

I’ve done a test cake as I had cakes in the freezer which needed using. I seemed to have mastered the pattern she wanted and I doweled the cake with 9 dowles in the lower tier which was a 10″ cake and then put an 8″ and then put a 6″ on top of that. When I came back a few hours later the 3rd tier appeared to be secure but the second tier had moved. Normally I just use ganache or royal icing between my tiers and have no problems but this buttercream malarky is driving me mad. I took the second tier off and the holes which the dowels had made when put in the cake were bigger and the dowels were able to move. How on earth do I secure the tiers?

Also as you previously suggested I used candy melts and I’d already tried using the freeze spray but still no joy. This is the first time I’ve really been worried about a wedding cake but I am getting nervous failure is not an option.

Help

Wow, you really are having some problems! Did you try adding ganache to the buttercream, even a small amount just for sticking down? I don’t work with buttercream but I know lots of people who do without having this much trouble. All I can suggest now is perhaps to also use a centre dowel through all the tiers to keep them from moving or try sturdy cake stacker for peace of mind. Here’s the link : http://www.sturdycakestackers.com/

9,925

Hello

I tried buttercream with ganache and also a batch with the meringue powder both acted the same. I’ve put the cake in the fridge and then put the second tier on and it felt OK so I decided to test it out in the car to see if it was safe enough to travel and the car was on a slight bank and as soon as I put the cake in the boot the second tier slipped straight away.

I was thinking I might put sugar paste on the top of the cakes where the tier above will sit what do you think. Does sugar paste stick to buttercream OK this is really doing my head it. I’ve googled everything and I can’t understand why its happening

This get curiouser and curisouser. I have to say I’ve not known anything like this either. Did you make the buttercream using real butter or margarine? If it’s with real butter, I am surprised that it is behaving this way. Have you tried making a very stiff buttercream, one that crusts? Failing all, I guess you could just cover the tops of the cakes with sugarpaste as a base for the tiers to sit on. Yes, sugarpaste sticks to buttercream, it’s used all the time over buttercream base. Good luck!

ps what recipe did you use for buttercream?

9,925

Hello

1. I followed the recipe in the link above to Craftsy using the meringue powder and I used sugar and crumbs flavoured icing sugar and Lurpak

2. I also did a buttercream with sugar and crumbs flavoured icing sugar and Lurpak with a ratio of 500g butter to 1kg icing sugar and added 6% white chocolate ganache as suggested.

3. I also made the above without the white chocolate ganache added.

I’ve quickly baked up some packet cakes (for ease, speed and cost) to have another practice starting from scratch. I wondered the recipe in the link to Craftsy above states 681g butter to 908g icing sugar which is the equivalent to the 1 and half pounds of butter and 2lbs of icing sugar it states in the recipe. I wondered if I needed to just do the normal 2:1 ratio of icing sugar to butter and simply add the 2 tbsp of meringue powder to that.

Can I just clarify prior to putting a 2nd tier on the cake should the first tier be cold or at room temperature, mind you I’ve tried both ways and it still didn’t stick if you know what I mean.

I’m sorry to keep posting but your help is appreciated. I must say I seem to be learning a lot about the wheres and whyfores of buttercream to say the least. Failure is not an option ha ha.

Do the 2:1 ratio icing sugar to butter sounds more sensible and I think you’ll find it will crust over much better. If the weather is warmish, add the ganache to give it more structure or use the meringue powder. Perhaps also try another brand of butter, I always find Lurpack a little on the soft side. For easier handling, I would keep the tiers as cold as possible before stacking.
Don’t worry about keep posting, it’s always good to have someone to sound things out with. I have to say I’ve never come across this problem before. I do hope you have it resolved by using 2:1 ratio.